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...in simplified, easier-to-understand terms, the brian has limited focus. Focusing on multiple things (the 'parallel processing' I disagree with) reduces efficiency proportional to the amount of things you are attempting to focus on.
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But yes, the original basic meaning of the word multitask obviously means to do more than one thing at the same time.
11:56 PM
In the case of humans, that's only correct "over time", but not on a much deeper level of how the brain is actually working.
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 11:56 PM
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And, yes - technically 'splitting focus' in that way is rapidly switching between those tasks, hence why I would state it is not parallel processing as people present it from their subjective perspective.
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[Well yeah. But we really don't care about efficiency. It is more efficient if just 1 person focuses on everything. But that's not really important to us.]
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Efficient isn't really up to you in that definition. It's simply a comment on how the brain actually handles it.
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So, when explaining it, I greatly prefer explaining it with the external perspective as well so people understand that there is no magic, no unexplained, unsubstantiated ability being claimed.
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[We are both thinking and acting to us. So we are. So we "parallel process". Simple] (edited)
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Based on that TED talk itself, people can certainly make themselves much less efficient at it..
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...Silina, what you just said is literally why I said what I did regarding object permanence earlier.
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What do you think the difference between parallel processing and multitasking is, Silina?
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Parallel processing, for productive conversation's sake, only refers to conscious tasks requiring focus and effort.
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okay, yes, Winter, I believe everyone here knows that basic fundamental concept of this conversation. I've described it as "parallel" processing before a couple times, but only as a sort of term to describe what it's like, as for many people, a decreased brain power/efficiency to each subject is more than enough per subject
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[Dunno. One feels like doing it at once?] (edited)
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99etc.% of what's going on in your mind are running parallel just fine.
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When talking about parallel processing and multitasking, it’s a matter of focus, not “what’s going on”
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You are coming at this from an egocentric perspective where your subjective experience is literally the case - but when other people are coming at this from an external perspective of what is literally, physically happening without the illusion of subjectivity, saying they are "wrong" somehow because what literally happens in the brain isn't the same as the subjective experience you have isn't really productive or even addressing their statements at all.
11:59 PM
That is the problem.
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We can do a lot of things without deliberate, substantial focus, from yawning to breathing to stretching.
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Ultimately, your brain is fast enough and smart enough that the decrease is entirely negligible as your focus is "split" and cycling between the two really fast, so it may not be advantageous in the long run, but what matters here is that the subjective experience effectively portrays it to the point where it is functionally equivalent to parallel processing.
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[It is pointing out the weakness of the definition. There are multiple ways to define things like "parallel processing". And there are multiple ways to look at statements like "you are thinking 2 things at ones".]
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...tch.
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what do you all mean when you talk about parallel processing?
12:00 AM
does this imply tulpa and host are thinking in full consciousness at the same time at the regular?
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In simple - if people are claiming parallel processing, they truly need to actually define what they are claiming.
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does this parallel processing involve a reduction in ability overall?
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[Wouldn't even know what you mean with consciousness hehe]
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It's like saying packaging your libraries with your software and referencing them to external files are fundamentally different and affect the end result. The performance difference is totally negligible and ultimately what really matters here is the subjective experience of the end user.
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thinking in full, thinking "like a person" if you get the idea
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Not just thinking, but feeling and behaving.
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Especially when it comes to people taking you seriously.
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would there be two separate hamsters in two separate wheels
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[I claim we feel like we think multiple things at the same time. One of us can write while another plays in wonderland or counts. At least it feels that way to us.]
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The same wheel, being the body.
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or would it be one hamster running between two wheels
12:01 AM
or hwat
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Great.
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what exactly is parallel processing here?
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Then you've made your claim. I have no disagreement that it is what you feel.
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Two hamsters (thoughts, emotions, behaviour) one body (wheel)
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If you write programs, it's like saying it really matters if you use a hacky, standards-breaking solution compared to a built in one on a modern system where wasting a few CPU cycles doesn't actually matter much. End result is functionally identical, if there's a negligible drop in performance, well, it's negligible.
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I would disagree if you said that is literally what is happening, and presented your subjective perspective as evidence of such.
12:02 AM
There we are.
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[Well to me that is literally what is happening. So I claim that as well.]
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The two hamsters can bump into each other and obstruct each other, but they can also run side by side or in different ways.
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No, it's not literal, but the term parallel processing as I've used and understood it in the context of tulpamancing for as long as I've known about this is just that - it's not true parallel processing, but the end result is functionally identical, so it can be described as parallel processing without needing context.
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Ah. Then I would say you are incorrect, because the illusion your brain presents is separate from how the brain functions.
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So, essentially defining a term by symptoms.
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[It's still a subjective claim though because I say "to me" which is pretty much the same as I said before.]
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There's a reason I love the idea of "abstraction" "constructions" in tulpamancy, it would really help to seal up these disagreements.
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It should really instantly click with you the moment you read it, Winter, if you want to talk about not taking people seriously and such.
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Ehh, I guess it's a TED talk on the impact of video games on your brain. She only briefly mentions multitasking means switching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=448naPYDVpA&t=9m28s
12:04 AM
But that just says to me it's a commonly accepted definition.
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"To me, the air is literally made of fire. So, I claim that it is literally fire as well as it being subjectively fire to me."
12:04 AM
^This is the problem.
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Also, the other result when searching for this was a TED talk called "The myth of multitasking"...
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That is the direct extention of words.
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No time for everyone to watch it now, but
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[Wow, must be hot for them]
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Except, in the case of parallel processing, people generally have the mental faculty to understand that people are speaking from a subjective point of view.
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Shockingly, nobody is actually lighting on fire.
12:05 AM
But if the point isn't made with that, I don't know how else I can rephrase it.
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Language and communication do not exclusively rely on literal definitions of the words and phrases, context exists too, and context is important. What she is saying isn't relevant to what you're saying, since this entire time she has been claiming it in entirely subjective terms.
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I will say that I do not think you have a valid point there, High. People do not broadly assume that parallel processing, or anything in tulpamancy, is not what it appears to be or is said to be. I think there is a big layer of either dishonesty or half truth if you say parallel processing when that is not what you really mean.
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[Well the claim is about a physical thing. I just don't make claims at all about brain structure because I don't find them relevent to the question. Like "I can think multiple things at once" I don't translate it to "my brain can preform multiple actions at once"]
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I don't think you are necessarily being dishonest, but I do think that is what ends up happening when the person who does not understand what you mean reads the use of parallel processing as it is commonly used.
12:07 AM
I think this sort of language is a big big big source of the "doubt cliff" a lot of new tulpamancers find themselves on after being in tulpamancy for a few months.
👍 1
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If a statement is made in a factual manner, it is assumed that the person is stating it as fact.
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Tulpamancy is mostly a subjective experience as it has not really been measured objectively as far as I know, so when someone who is experienced in this community (example, Winter) sees information regarding someone's experience with their tulpa, then it should be taken as subjective, given the context of the subject matter.
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...that isn't unambiguous at all.
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[I think putting to much emphasis on physical structures you can't see is just stupid.]
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@Deleted User I quite prefer trying to get people to not state subjective experience as factual.
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By fact, you mean "The case for them and so presumably (and worth suggesting to others) as actually the case"
12:08 AM
Not the actual scientific use of the word fact, of course.
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[I can feel like I think multiple things at once. If I make the claim that I do I don't see it in any way as a lie.]
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[If they try to do the same they will get the same result. Feeling like thinking multiple things at once]
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Not as a scientifically tested fact, @Reisen, no.
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[Or feeling like a tulpa actually exists]
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Feeling it is not the same as doing it. If you claim you are actually doing it, that’s a lie. If you claim that you feel that you’re doing it, it’s not.
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That's another one.
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That's why I mention that I do not think anyone is actually lying, but I still think there is dishonesty there.
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Winter, have you ever claimed your Tulpa exists?
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@Blitzeen Precisely.
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[I am doing it.]
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winter is a tulpa
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ah
12:09 AM
sorry
12:09 AM
has Skye ever claimed you exist?
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...I think
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Quite frankly, given that "tulpas exist" are the basic fundamentals of this community, yes.
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they'll have to confirm
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If so, that's subjective, and it was portrayed as fact, therefore, it falls into the same thing you're criticizing people for.
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I don’t claim my “tulpa” exists, but I claim that I “feel as though he exists,” and I think that feeling is enough for a tulpa community to go off collectively
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[But see with Reguile here he sees the same thing you see about parallel processing as with the question "tulpas exist" pretty much why my answer is in the same format for both questions.]
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I would not bundle me with anyone Sete
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Honestly I only want to mediate here but I'm not sure how. Silina has a right to say how they think things are based on their experience, and you guys are saying it can't be the case due to popularly held belief. But.. it's a popularly held belief for a reason.
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While we can measure changes we can not directly measure the tulpa itself and therefore your experience is subjkective and claiming that a tulpa exists in and of itself is claiming a subjective experience as an objective fact.
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